On a technical level, how is TikTok being blocked/banned in the US?
Can I still sideload the app to my phone? Is it only being banned from the two big app stores? Is there a penalty for being found in possession of the software on US soil?
I believe I read that the ban prohibited new downloads but wouldn’t stop existing users from continuing to use, however the parent company kinda put a middle finger up and said they would stop service in the US completely, probably by IP/geofencing? Take with grain of salt.
Yeah. ByteDance, the owners, are choosing to block US users to kick up the maximum fuss possible. From my understanding they didn’t need to, they just risked withering away because there would be no new users.
To be honest, I’m surprised they care as much as they seem to- the US is such a small percentage of their potential user base. If my app lost 5% of my potential new users I’d be curious why, but I probably wouldn’t put any effort into getting them back.
That sounds like self harm
They know that Trump will make a fuss about it next week and release the ban, blaming the Dems, so that people forget the China tariffs he has been talking all campaign.
Trump is so predictable that these totalitarian governments play him like a fiddle.
Yeah, they won’t geofence. Still money to be made from existing US users. And no one puts principles above profits.
Governments do.
Hmm. I’m gonna install it then never use it again lol
No app store download and no hosting in the u.s. Even if they weren’t blocking u s. Users the amount of video traffic suddenly hitting their servers outside the country would cripple their infrastructure and seriously hinder other Internet traffic. Since net neutrality doesn’t exist anymore, ISPs can be paid to block it or seriously cripple it.
Still totally legal to install the app and access the content. However the same content will be reposted to other platforms which will be a great passive revenue stream for someone.
How can ISPs tell what app is requesting data? Doesnt it all look the same on their end?
IP address and Domain Names
Why do they care enough to listen? It isn’t a US based company. I understand if they remove their US servers, but why do they have to block IPs?
Can’t US users just get a VPN? Is this whole situation a ploy to ban VPNs and privacy?
Yes, they can just use a VPN. I’ve told this to several people in my life and many of them write that off as being too difficult to figure out. I even gave my VPN un & pw to a family member with a link to download the app and they still just said “nah.”
Some people just can’t be bothered to try, I guess.
This is how.
There are multiple ways of doing this and I’m not sure which methods tik tok is using.
-
ip address there’s a group called IANA that issues blocks of IP addresses to ISPs and there a companies like Maxmind that package that info. apps can create rules block requests based on that info that block requests coming from a specific location or return an error to the user
-
removing from the app store Companies can ask app stores to no longer offer downloads in a specific region and as the app updates it will become more busted over time
-
user information Based info provided by the user directly during sign up or from the social login a user used to sign up with tik tok
-
Afaik you should still be able to sideload it and use the service with a VPN
So are American ISPs being forced to block TikTok’s server’s IPs?
afaik the legislation doesn’t include active blocking of a qualifying service’s (which includes tiktok by name, but is not limited to only it or bytedance) traffic…
it only prohibits the distribution of their ‘apps’ (such as via google/apple ‘stores’)–this is the part that does most the heavy lifting, and hosting of their services within the u.s.
No, US is not blocking it (there isn’t even infrastructure in place for such a request, we don’t have a “Great Firewall of China”)
However, the VPN is required because reportedly TikTok themselves will stop allowing US based users to see content which is above and beyond what the law calls for
The firewall is the 3 megacorps that own all other ISPs. It just takes a phone call.
Good thing we live a country with plenty of good honorable ISPs. Xfinity, Verizon and uhh… What’s that other one that offers 10mbps for $200/m?
I dont think any ISP will be forced to given that both the current and next WH have said they won’t enforce a ban. If it goes dark, it’ll be TikTok themselves blocking access
Edit: called it
No
No
It will probably be removed from DNS (and appstores). Google IANA , and DNS if you want to know more.
PS Ofc the company itself will stop its services. It’s not like they want beef with a whole country (any, not just US).
I’m not an expert. Removing it from DNS would stop anyone using that DNS from accessing it, right? So if I’m in Australia, using a US DNS, I wouldn’t be able to access it. And vice versa- Anyone in the US could just change their DNS to something outside the US.
Yea. DNS is just an address book (name to IP). There’s a bit more to how it is structured, but it’s not that complicated.
Actually thinking about it, they would not have to remove the “domain” (tiktok.com or whatever it is), they (tiktok) would just have to stop using it for business. They could like put a banner that says “tiktok is no longer avalible here” or whatever.
Other part is IP. As you said, you could just change what dns server your phone asks for IPs and use it like normal. The government could block the IP at the big nodes going out of the country. Then you would have to use a vpn. Idk what they (usa or tiktok) have done, but I know tiktok will not actively try to skirt around it and will remove themselves. I would expect someone stupid like musky to try something, but big companies are usually serious.
Anyway, they can’t stop vpns. But vpns are a pain for regular folk.
Unlikely
Don’t worry, trump will just cancel that whole shit
Is that a good or bad thing?
I feel like it’s pretty irrelevant honestly.
Like if my house is burning down I don’t care whether I have my blue boxers or my green boxers nor whether China knows.
I believe Google and Apple are to be fined if they don’t remove the app from their stores.
We don’t have the ability to nationally block the domains and IPs, so current users will still be able to access it. So you shouldn’t need a VPN.
Android users could side load the app if they want.
What is sideloading?
On Android you can download apps (.APK files) from the web, and install them without any app store.
Oh gotcha I’ve done that before just didn’t know the term. Thanks!
Downloading the APK.
Its a silly term to say installing from any app store that Google doesn’t control
Not quite. You don’t need any app store at all.
You literally download an APK file from a website or anywhere, then install it directly. Could even be a friend with a thumb drive. Doesn’t matter how you get it, it’s just a file.Yeah. Dont do that. Its how you install viruses.
Install through another app store like fdroid. Its the secure way to get APKs
That’s got nothing to do with what sideloading means.
And the risks are very overblown.
While it’s possible, it’s extremely rare.Mostly because the potent target pool is so small. Bigger potentials for bad guys if they trick app stores into approving trojan horse apps, because everyone thinks app stores are safer.
Public DNS servers hosted in the US will get notified to delist the domain or direct it to an alternate IP. ISPs will get notified to route IP traffic elsewhere.
Source this information, because it is almost positively incorrect.
I have personal experience with backbone carriers.
Yeah, I do to. We’re not talking about theoretically blocking access to a site nation wide. We’re talking about the TikTok ban, which doesn’t stipulate any sort of network blocking, it’s just a delisting from the app stores.
The government has never required dns providers to remove records for a domain, or required ISPs to null route traffic to IPs. That’s almost certainly a First Amendment issue, and I can only imagine that such an order would be immediately challenged in court.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Internet_censorship_in_the_United_States
Trading with the Enemy Act (TWEA)
In March 2008, the New York Times reported that a blocklist published by the Office of Foreign Assets Control (OFAC), an agency established under the Trading with the Enemy Act 1917 and other federal legislation, included websites, so that US companies are prohibited from doing business with those websites and must freeze their assets. The blocklist had the effect that US-based domain name registrars must block those websites. According to the article, eNom, a private domain name registrar and Web hosting company operating in the US, disables domain names that appear on the blocklist.[38] It described eNom’s disabling of a European travel agent’s web sites advertising travel to Cuba, which appeared on the list.[39] According to the report, the US government claimed that eNom was “legally required” to block the websites under US law, even though the websites were not hosted in the US, were not targeted at US persons, and were legal under foreign law.
As far as null routing IPs, we’ll see.
We won’t see, it’s never happened and isn’t a requirement in the ban bill.
Read the cited article in Wikipedia. https://web.archive.org/web/20170407043030/https://www.nytimes.com/2008/03/04/us/04bar.html eNom didn’t block DNS users from resolving the domains, they were the registrar for the domains. The domain owners were paying eNom to list their records. As soon as the domain owners moved to a different DNS provider, anyone in the US would be able to access the sites again, even users using eNom public dns servers (if they exist idk).
You didn’t cite a case of the US blocking DNS providers from resolving a domain, you cited a case of the US blocking a registrar from doing business with an entity on a blocklist published by OFAC.
Didn’t know that
This is not an action that will be initiated by the incoming ban, just fyi.
To be fair, it wouldn’t be every ISP that would reroute, just backbone ones. Their routing tables would filter down to regional and last mile networks.
When have any Tier One providers in the Is done such a thing in the US?
deleted by creator
This isn’t North Korea.
Even China and Russia can’t fully block things.
Our networks aren’t nearly as controlled as theirs.
Is it blocked at all? Biden said he wouldn’t enforce it yet.
he wouldn’t be able to, anyway.
the deadline is the sunday the 19th. monday the 20th is mlk day (federal holiday, courthouses closed. ag couldn’t file proceedings to enforce the legislation) and the last morning of the biden administration. diaperking is then in charge. even though it was his idea to begin with, he’s flopped on the issue.
I believe thar they said in the news here in Europe, that any service that distributes the tok tok app to the USA market, will be fined $5000 per download!
It will not be illegal to have but it won’t be updated in the US market and new users won’t be able to download it
The US servers are being shut off because they don’t want to risk the fines even though the current administration said they wouldn’t enforce them. TikTok will go black for us users tomorrow. I’m sure there will some way around it for those dedicated enough to find it but the average user will lose access on 1/19.
Generally the large ISP will receive an order to sinkhole the tt domains for their users. And most normal people use a modem supplied by the ISP it will use the ISP DNS server or their phones will use the mobile providers DNS servers.
It will not block a determined person but it will effectively block it for a large chunk of the US internet.
Man I wish I invested in some VPN stock a few years ago. I’m sure they’ll be making a killing with all the us porn bans and now this.
A publicly listed VPN provider would be a huge red flag. No matter what they said, their primary commitment would be to shareholders.
deleted by creator
Do as all the shithole countries do. Use a VPN.
I know how to get around it. I was curious to know the level at which it was being blocked. Is it the DNS, is it some kind of firewall…etc.
Tbh, it’s tik tom blocking you, not the US, the US only requires the app stores to remove it. I think the easiest way for TikTok to find out where the request comes from is the client IP. And the only way to get around this is through a VPN. I don’t exactly know though, I haven’t seen a lot of technical stuff around it, and I’m not in the US to test it. I’d love to know if anyone else has a tip on this.
